Good Wrist Action Is No Wrist Action, Part 11

Cool, thanks! It's that kind of thought process I am seeking, I'll definitely give it a try.

Exactomundo,

The fewer angles, the fewer movements to have to control. KISS METHOD.

It comes from the throw-out motion created by the drop from the top and secondly from the arm rotation from the slot through impact into the forward catcher's mitt. The "wrist snap" term describes the feel but does not describe what actually happens.

Pretty much everything else you might see in rotational swings is window dressing.

Check your inbox.

I found a thought that helped me in this situation. I think "thumb up" (meaning left hand to a rightie) at the end of the BUS and think of the same thumb pointing to the ball at impact and again "thumb up" (this time right hand), at the end of the FUS. Seems to reduce over rotation.

Thanks, Craig.  It crossed my mind to look in the Manual earlier today but I forgot to do it when I returned from the driving range.  I made the mistake of asking first. 

You are not alone in your doubts about the stance. I think that the heels, knees and hips are the most important part of your lower body to be parallel to the target line. If the forward foot is flaired  more than the rear foot and the forward foot heel remains parallel to the target line the BUS is restricted. This might be good for someone having trouble going into the Sacred Burial Ground with their BUS. Overdoing this forward foot flair with heels parallel to the target line, may however,  in effect open up your lower body stance by twisting the forward knee and hip away from the target line. If you try to get your toeline parallel to the target line with a 70 degree foot flair , you will have to move your forward heel toward the target line. That move will close your heels, knees and hips to the target line.  If I understand your method for taking your stance it is very similar to mine in trying to keep the heels parallel to the target line with a little more flair with the forward foot and it certainly does work. 

All the best,
Dave

Roy,
It was great to meet you this week though briefly. The experience with Surge this week was great and meeting many vertical fans was too.

I tried the flare out last week and found some good, but was hooking dead right.  After the detailed discussion you referenced above,Robert F., I finally figured out the flare and used it on Saturday.  IT WAS AWESOME.  I easily picked up 10 yards on the irons, but was even more happy with accuracy.  My chips were hitting much closer to the pin.  The drives were just rocketing through the air and most shots had a definite high flight.  My golf group could not believe it.  Luckily, I had told them that I think I finally got the last piece of my swing, before we started the day.  And, I was consistent on just about every shot.  Hitting greens with by 5 iron and rescue club, that is the way it is supposed to be.
DJ was so enthused in the video, and I am right there as a believer.  The flare just puts you into the right load position and the follow through to a t-finish becomes pretty automatic.  Everything DJ mentioned was what I was able accomplish.  You are restricted from over turning in the backswing, and the flow through to facing the target is pretty much guaranteed with the front foot flared.  The reason for the longer distance was that my club contact on the ball was so much more powerful as I was able to do the bump and get much more mass of center going into the ball.  I also will never take another swing without flaring out.   It does take practice and focus to get comfortable with the flare.  So, play around with it. You do not need a club.  I used the kitchen table and tiles to set up my toe line.  After a bit of practice, I found it easy to line up the toes on the target line, as you state, Robert F..  Best of all, I was able to sink into a pre-set back foot that was comfortable and confident.  I have not had so much fun in the 7 years I have been playing.  As another surgite mentioned, I just now have to recalibrate for the new distance.  Kevin McCarthy

There is no confusion among the enlightened, just gratitude for the simplistic body friendly adaptability of the PPGS. Stop fighting against it's principles, drink the cool aid and give yourself over to it. Only then will you also become enlightened and see what we are talking about.

The only thing you have to loose is the bodies aches and pains as you age and continue to play. This is the MOST body friendly swing you will ever find. Learn it and use it, and you will then have your proof!

That is probably a good idea. I will need to create a youtube account. I'll do it when I have some time.

I think Steve needs to get tested. LOL On a good day that's a pw for me. GW 115 - 120

Craig--thought I would write in support of  your instruction on holding the shaft in the fingers.  I ignored it, partially because I was comfortable with holding the club in my palms rather than my fingers (due to other sports), and because it felt more stable.  The "aha!" came later when I was trying to figure out how to get the club into the position that Surge  does at the top, with arms to about 10 o'clock and club shaft to about 1 o'clock, face on.  I could get my arms to around 10 o'clock but not the shaft to the desired direction because the angle that the club was coming out of my hands was a limiting factor.  So, I worked backwards, moved the shaft to around 1 o'clock, and found out immediately that the butt of the club moved from my palms to the crimped fingers.

Holding the club in my fingers also kept me from gripping the club too tightly and losing the suppleness in my hands.

Cerv, that would be great if you can send Greg's video of the 3P grip, its one of my favourite instructional videos and I was too lax in the old PPGS website days to save it in my archive.

Can you attach it to an email and send it to:

edited for privacy purposes  

(I will edit @yahoo:disqus 
his address out immediately after replying to you to avoid spammers etc)

Regards, Craig

I battle with the same issue and think as I get more vertical without the correct bump /transition creates the going right,  as Steve says, bump>let the arms fall at the top. The wrong action is for a direct move towards the ball with the arms to start the FUS.
I understand what is needed but really am struggling to get the timing right and putting it all together, I also don't release correctly at impact and rotate into the forward mitt, I can feel myself sometimes holding on to the open clubface through impact and releasing to late which adds to the balls going right.

Regards Keith 

Robert,

Nice turn around on the back nine. Thanks for the Surge details, 73 is pretty good. I couldn't help but get the thought, Like Father, Like Son, when you mentioned the missed putts though. All in a humorous note.

I am always amazed at how much time my buddies spent with their drivers on the range and then continually miss 4 and 6 foot putts.  It is so hard for them to realize that 4' putts counts the same as that 275yd drive. One stroke. Every putt missed cancels out one good drive, even if it was over 300yds. The only thing on the card is the total strokes.

I am glad to here all are having a wonderful time. Wish I were there to enjoy it with all of you. Soak it all in folks, what an experience.

134 gap wedge, damn. What do you use for shorter distances?

Robert:

   Thanks for the compliment!  Great to meet you Buddy

    Otis (formerly known as Amos)

Steve,

I got your post before you backspaced. Isn't halfway between  the heel and the toes the middle of the arch - the center of balance on the feet? I would think that would make a close-to-perfect pivot point.

I'm shocked. You're saying that Surge is teaching something that disagrees with currently popular golf swing theory? ;-)

There are many theories about how best to hit a golf ball, and most of them developed based on somebody finding success doing something, and thinking that was the key to success.

Surge's PPGS comes from understanding what the most consistent swing would be (a Ferris wheel forever on the aiming line), knowing that we humans can't do that, and figuring out with the help of physiologists, physicists, and measured experimentation how to come as close to that as a human body can.

Are there golfers who are successful using intentional wrist cock? Of course! But they're exceptional. For the average person, consistency and power are more likely to be found with no intentional wrist cock.

Thanks for good try, but honestly I think this created some more confusion on the ideal degree  of right cock/hinge of the wrist with the right release before impact. Could somebody pls. comment.

Heikki 60

CervezaFria--thanks for the offer.

If I think about keeping firm wrists too much it sometimes makes me feel too rigid and makes it difficult to get to the "L" shape with vertical club, almost like the club is pointing at 10 oclock(face on).
I think the initial rotation of the forearm is really important to getting vertical, I have been slowing down this rotation so have rotated fully only once at the toeline which then seems to make you flip the club to a laid off position.
DJ seems to sets this position almost instantly, whilst Don seems is a touch slower.

I really need to work on this again, and hope one day soon everything drops in to place!
Regards Keith Kent

T, just getting ready to head over to pick up Amos and make our wat back over to Piaute. I tee off at 9:27am. Wanted to mention that the missed putts were mostly over 6-8 feet. Also he does have some challenges with his "near" vision that makes it tougher.Said he's going to a vision specialist that is going to fix it soon. His "far" vision is strong though. He is meticulous in picking a distant target and knowing right where he wants to land the ball before he ever reaches for a club. Set up determines the results and he makes every second count in his preperation. then to see him line up and hit each shot to his target is really impressive.

Surge did make that comment, but also said that you can't see your heels when setting up and swinging, and that we should use the toeline. If your toes are on the parallel-left line and both your feet (shoes) are exactly the same length and you flare your feet equally, then your heels will be aligned. But. you cannot see your heels to set up properly.

i am going to start working on choking down from 44 - 43 with my driver now that I am done with tournaments  I do have one left if it happens in Oct. There having the winners from the local Golf Channel AM tour against the winners from the tour I play on. I think I can get away with cutting my driver down without adding weight back if I go that way it is swing weighted at D6. If I like it at 43 I will probably let my builder do the cutting down just to make sure its right.

Hopefully your job search will work out for you soon. This economy has been screwed up since the Pres. candidates were announced in 2008 that last have of year we went from a 55,000 profit in the first half to losing 11,000 in the second half of that year.. We are still down about 30% on sales but we are surviving..I am the Pres. of a small chemical company we make industrial cleaners.   

Surge,I saw your "show"with DJ where he showed several swings with his left foot 60-70 degrees to the target! QUESTION: The toe-line now points to the left! but the heel of the left foot stays at the same level as the heel of the right foot(I believe this is right) parallel to the normal toe-line. Is it necessary to put the left foot FORWARD to get a normal toe-line parallel to the aiming line?I think it is important to keep the heels parallel to the aiming line?

Kind regards from The Netherlands,

Willem Vegers

Man, that's the best explanation Iv'e seen on the wrist cock, wish I had seen it 15 years
ago. Can't count how many times I was told to set/cock/break my wrists to be in a power
position. Totally agree with RobertF about past legends dictating swing theories based
on their own personal capabilities which they developed from a young age and drilled.
I honestly think that the Surge method will start creeping into all golfing annals because
of its simplicity, accuracy and body friendly aspects. 
 

The bell ringing analogy is excellent. I've always felt that bell ringing is like vertical golf and it helps me to ring better and to swing better. If you make a pull/hook on a bellrope you can be in trouble!

Great to hear that you are having success with the flared foot Kevin.  Long  may it continue for you. Yesterday I flared my feet,but not to 70degrees. I to start with was pulling the shots left about 15feet. What I did was pure heresy for PPGS. I hearkened back to my pre PPGS swing,when I was hitting good solid and reasonably accurate shots. I didn't 'pop up like a pop tart out of a toaster' as fast as normal. I was stunned at the result. I was still quick thru' the ball,maybe it was a split second slower only,  hard to say.
I used 5 balls [two found and my usual 3 I normally play on the course]. All 5balls were in an almost dead straight line on the pin, from the edge of the green to within 8feet of the pin.The 5th and last landed just short of the pin nearly going in, and ending up 8feet above the hole. From the ball furthest from the hole to the one behind the hole,if the dispersion was 6" I would be amazed.
It is my opinion now [advanced years or not, my reflexes are still as quick as they were when I was 18], I had been popping up too fast while swinging the same way.
Slowing down a teensy weensy bit, resulted in power and accuracy. Now I have to wait until they have cored the greens before I can swing on the course again.So back  out on the rear deck[porch] to swing again and groove it in.
No doubt I lacked the Oriental gentlemen Ti Ming and Tem Po previously. Note: I saw this yesterday after the practice. Knowing it and doing it are two different things. Now for the rotating arms hmmmm.
PPGAS and we will with Surge's help and that of the Surgite Clan.
Good luck Kevin

Align with the heels lol !
I think us golfers might be over thinking something that is more simple than we are letting it be.
Just align with the toes to the toeline, flare both feet, flare the forward foot more if it suits you.
This shouldn't pull the knees and hips out of alignment unless you have very little or no  movement, in which case you find the point where you can flare the feet without issues.
I have just tried this and can flare both feet almost 90*, it isn't comfortable nor could I swing a club properly whilst in this position  without probably causing strains in the ankles/knees but it does show you how flexible we are.

Or am I totally missing the point?

Roger:  Just a question and completely off the golf topic:  I notice your company makes industrial cleaners.  Perhaps, do you make carpet "heavy-traffic-area" pre-cleaners?  At the assisted living center where my wife is at, I do a lot of volunteer work, and carpet cleaning is on that list.  The hallways and dining room take a beating and I'm looking for a good pre-spray for these heavy-traffic areas.  Anyway, just a shot in the dark... :-)  Enjoy your comments on the blog  :-)    R2

Willem,

There was a big discussion of this in the comments of several of the daily videos in the days following the live show. The official PPGS answer is that the toe line is the line formed by the tips of the toes, no matter how much your feet are flared, and it should always be parallel to the aiming line. We do not judge alignment by our heels, but by our toes. Surge has always made a point of this (as has Doc Griffin) in earlier videos where he's talked about people trying flares greater than 30 degrees, that you must always be sure that the line formed by the tips of your toes remains parallel to the aiming line.

Cock/hinge is not the way to think. When you do this you are left with trying to anticipate the contact with the ball, which is near impossible givin the amount of time the club is in contact with the ball. ROTATION is where you need to focus your attention. Some of my best results have come from feeling that my left wrist is firm at the top of the back swing and not hinging or breaking in any way. I can hit the ball crisper and straighter and it feels more powerfull. A firm wrist means less margin for era as you need to return the club to the ball in the same position as your setup. Try playing round with your rotation a bit. Maybe early like D.J  or abit later like Surge to see what suits you. It should happen fairly naturally