Use Caution When Listening To Conventional Instruction

Steve, Had a hair cut just like Yul Brynner in Libya mid 1960's. Dared to have it done, won a fiver. My best friend who provoked it, made lots of money hahahaha. Don't say don't to me or other Surgites. Indeed, 'So let it be written, so let it be done. PS How many soldiers have been ORDERED to grow their hair by their boss? hahahaha
Surge is the way to go.PMG and Succeed.

Your right about golf being a challenge, but I guess thats what keeps us coming back. That & a few other things I could mention

Cheers Russty

Dear Surge,
It does not matter to me whether or not the rotation swing has more power or control.  My back will not tolerate that amount of rotation without extreme pain.
Therefore, I don't care.  Yor swing has allowed me to play golf again and join in with my friends and family.  I am never going to be a Tiger Woods.  I play to enjoy the game and I am getting better.
Those with golfers with bad backs see you as a godsend.  People at my club with back problems are starting to take notice.
Keep up the good work.

Brendan Manning
Sydney Australia

It's taken a while but I have been learning to turn off my brain and trust my swing lately. I do all my thinking before I step up to the ball now and then it's all rythym and tempo. It was tough to give up control and trust my training with the Surge swing and just let it go but getting good results with less stress is worth it.

Obie, one of our best instructors, Dave Seeman, is based out of Townsend, DE. Since you didn't mention your town I don't know how far a drive that would be, but I do know it's about a hundred miles from Alexandria, VA.

Dave is teaching this winter so give him a call if you would like a lesson. His phone number is 302 373-4783 and his email address is dseeman@swingsurgeon:twitter .com

If you live too far away, we are about to launch an online golf lesson program where you can upload video you shoot of your swing and have a Swing Surgeon certified instructor analyze it, mark it up as necessary and then provide a soundtrack over the video letting you know what you need to work on. Stay tuned for more details.

Tom Jans

Doc,

I know what you are saying, BUT, you may just want to watch this. It might change your mind when you realize there is a right way to put your shoes and socks on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...

PMG

No offense, but that is old news and not worth Surge wasting his time on. He refutes it every day, as do so many of the golfers who have learned this swing.

When I'm practicing, I try to work on getting two things to happen simultaneously. I try to pull my back (right) shoulder and hip away from the toe line, while at the same time lifting with my arms. I'll do this over and over, just to the top of the BUS. Once I set up to an actual ball, I don't want to think about any of that, though. I just think about my tempo and let the rest take care of itself.

Robert, what you just described is what I call getting out of my own way.  I choose the club, pick the line using a spot about 6 inches in front of the ball on that line, take a practice swing to get the feel and then just set up and swing the feel.  Took me some time to get to that routine, but when I do and trust it is when I get my best results.

Yes they all like making a full shoulder turn. Was watching a little bit of the Three Tour Challenge tonight and noticed that Cristie Kerr is quite vertical.

I think that it is easier to do this swing if the right/rear side leads the band. Just rotating the shoulders isn't specific enough for me because there are so many ways you can turn your shoulders.  To ensure that you make enough of a controlled turn try starting the move back to the catchers' mitt with a small move of the right hip. That small move of the hip will also get the right shoulder moving so it can do it's job of completing the turn and lift of the BUS. Thinking of  moving the right hip back first is a smooth and consistent way of starting the BUS and makes it a certainty that you will have turn as well as lift.

Remember watching that one about year. Yes impressive it is. Accurate he was. Wonder if that translates to great putting on the actual one that needs mowing? Impressive either way!

Good thots here. If I were him, I would not be touching that swing. So grooved: maintain it.
The tendency is to ramp it up when one has success, especially at that age. He was having none of that. In fact, his fully rotational buddy was trying to keep pace, and it was both hideous and hysterical. This was "less is more."Longevity....for his next 10 years and 100,000 swings there that much less wear and tear. 

Surge

You could not be more right.  Case in point, I was watching an interview that David Feherty did with Greg Norman the other night.  At one point the Shark mentioned 10 or 11 surgeries he's had over the years as a result of making the golf swing which "the human body was not designed to do".  I almost fell off my chair!!  I thought, Gee, where have I heard that one before?  Oh yeah, Surge has has only mentioned it a few million times...lol.

I found PPGS about a year and a half ago and as a converted rotational swinger I can vouch for the fact that it has allowed me to play as much as a week straight with absolutel NO aches or pains.  Have I perfected Surge's method?  No, but I play pain free and my game has improved steadily.  Like many Surgites I have some physical restrictions, but so far nothing compared to what many have described.  Getting old is not for sissies. ;0) 

I'm just very glad I found Surge when I did.  I retired last year and Surge's methods have allowed me to play and enjoy a game I'm passionate about.

Thank you, Surge.

Robert

I watched those shows also last night and DVRED them. There was some good info. I was looking at some videos of Raymond F'S swing last night by the way one of my favorite players I know he is laid off at the top of the BUS but his left arm and hands look to be on the toe line at the top. 
There should be some good short game lessons on this week at some point.

Roger 

PMGV & LITP

Running the club head down the target line is the pertinent point indeed Steve and its a great feeling when you are targeting that flag stick with a solidly hit shot but wishing that the distance control was better.

A closed club face half way back, I know that you've mentioned before that you don't gel with the one piece takeaway.    For me it's a natural thing to pivot around my trailing hip, moving my arms and shoulders together.   This automatically opens the club face and from there I'm thinking of getting to the thumbs up position for the vertical lift over the toe line.

My friend plays once a month and is one of those guys who goes to a driving range to just hit his driver hence his prowess off the tee.   On the fairway however he mostly hits chunkey monkeys and the same with his chipping.

It should be pointed out that the Surge is not completely alone in promoting a (more) vertical swing. CJ Goecks is also a staunch advocate of the limited turn and (more vertical) backswing.  However, CJ also brings some conventional elements such as wrist cock and hitting down on the ball (btw-never seen CJ take a true divot. hmmm.) I'm not sure how CJ's swing could be categorized as "rotational."  

So Surgites, we are not completely alone. CJ is really a pretty good teacher, although more abbreviated in teaching style & more aggressive in marketing.

Don, of course, is one-of-a-kind. You gotta love watching the backyard while the seasons change. There are a number of really good players that bring PPGS elements to their game. It's about results. If it works and is sustainable, the free market will eventually provide that feedback.

Stay tuned....

Okay Terry, I'll start tomorrow morning and do it that way the rest of my life!
"Those were da daaaaaaaaaays!"

I doubt he did it in direct response to these shows because he appears to have made this daily before they're airing. It si not the first time he has warned us against the common teachings of most modern rotational proponents. Certainly agree that we have an incomprable education available to us through Surge and are no longer ignorant of the "other guys" out there. Golfer beware!
Knowledge is power and = better, safer golf.

Just be careful about sharing any of Bill Murray's grass.

That's why my favorite show is the one with the champions tour players. They give the best tips and are often in line with Surge. I guess I can also identify with them better too age wise.

Thanks Robert, it is a great time of the year to play golf and our social group likes to hit off early like say 0630 or so to beat the heat in the warmer times of late December, January and early to mid Feb.

Many of our MIA golfers in the winter time come out of hiding to play at this time of year and right through to May when they again mysteriously go into hiding (or golfing hibernation) :-()

It's a little frustrating when the self doubts appear as to what you are doing with your golf swing especially in the areas that you are kicking ass with.  It's also a little disconcerting when you view comments from a supposedly "highly rated coach" which is contrary to what you are doing currently but you are getting great results, and for a long time, with a coach that is not "on the same side of the street" as this guy.   I'm just going to stick with what's working for me now and before and will continuously improve me into the future and that's the Surge.

I ran out of breath laughing too hard :-D

Asteward:

2 Timothy 2:23    Has some wise instruction in this regard.

PMG and Merry Christmas

Steve, Iv'e seen your swing and you ain't got any physical disabilities,
that only leaves mental and from what Iv'e seen on the blog with your
wit and analysis, I reckon you ain't got any mental disability either, LOL. 

I enjoy watching the daily videos on the vertical swing and have gotten a lot out of them.  Howewver, most of the personal instruction around Northern Virginia is by instructers who teach the rotational swing.  Can you recommend any instructors in Northern Virginia who teach the vertical swing?

Some older gentlemen I work with at my golf course complain of back pain. In fact the joke is is that your not a true golfer unless you wake up in the morning with back pain. I been using the Surge Swing for about a year now and I have no back or knee pain. I can hit a super large bucket of balls some times (185 balls) and I'm tired but not I'm not hurting. I guess I should add that I'm 51.

Well now....I never noticed that.

It is hereby noted. Maybe CJ is not
as squeaky clean as I thought he was.

(Great video clip, btw.)

So, is CJ...wait....is Goecks an advocate or an antagonist?
("CJ" is remarkably close to "DJ") That's just great.
Now the conspiracy theory people will start in. lol

I did see a college kid (at the range) who had what I call a "hybrid" swing. It was clearly rotational but with 1 huge element adaptation:
he was using a limited turn. 

Watched this kid just smoking and working one ball after the other with his hybrids, with really effortless ball striking. 

He had found a way to adapt this element into his swing.

Keith, maybe you can approach this gradually if completely vertical (12:00 when viewed down-the-line) is too much of an adjustment.

When I looked at your swing, it looked like you were at about 10:00 at the top of your backswing.  If you can get it to 11:00, that might be a good intermediate goal for now.  That is still within the PPGS parameters.  As you get more comfortable with that, you can try to get closer to 12:00.  If you never get comfortable at 12:00, that's okay too.  Even 11:00-11:30 is pretty darn vertical, and you will still derive benefits from that.

Never had other than a military initiation. Bullies usually regretted 'hazing', bullying or threatening me. Maybe a runt, but picking them off one at a time, between being beaten up by them, took time, but they eventually stayed well away from me, hahahaha.
My national costume is a kilt. A few folk wandering around will still remember decades later mocking me and calling it a skirt! Silly individuals ; - ]
Have a great day and PMG Steve. Working on my swing indoors, chucking it down with rain for the next few days here ; - [

We don't count the 6 inch restriction between our ears.  We all have that.  You know my tendency to overthink things, so mine is more severe than most.  ,0))

Just a word of caution to all Surgeites out there. Don't want anyone out there to make this mistake. My golf game reached an all time low towards the end of the season here in the northeast. I began to think and believe that I had no ability to do anything at all when it came to golf. Yes, it was because I was receiving instruction from both Surge and yes the other place. I found myself changing swing types from hole to hole (in my mind experimenting to see which one would suit me best on any given day). BIG MISTAKE! Sorry, Surge.....all vertical next season.

I need to do another video of my swing to see where I am at.

I went to the range tonight after practicing with the swingrite, most shots felt good when I just swung the club but when I think about getting vertical it knocks me way off and all sorts of shots appear. I just cannot get inside and my arm/shoulders just seem to far forward so I cannot drop them.
Anyway I justed got back in to it and hit fairly well with the driver, and again when I tried to adjust the swing and get more vertical it all goes wrong.

I don't really know where I am at really since my last video and since then I am sure I have limited my turn so maybe I am more vertical than I think.

If the video shows that I am not that vertical but I am hitting fairly well should I stick with the swing I have until I am playing consistent golf or persist with trying to alter it and play army golf until I get it!

It would be interesting to know if he was intentionally shortening his backswing for that practice to work on something, and if that's actually the way he plays on the course.
A limited turn is definitely one of the few elements that is easily pieced out for use in any swing, as is the firm wrists. Both can offer a great deal of help to rotational players struggling with pain and inconsistency.

Good timing with a reminder to be careful as we consider "conventional" wisdom. I have been watching the Golf channels Academy featuring Jonny Miller, Raymond Floyd and Sir Nick Faldo. Entertaining and informative and actually often in harmony with Surge. For example Floyd said that the most common weakness he would continually see in amatures is the big "A" alignment and normally to the right. All of them emphasised the fundementals. Jonny Millers take was interesting because he is a student of and great observer of other great pros present and past that all use very different approaches so that was interesting. Didn't care for Nicks promotion of the cocked wrists but he did make a helpful point that he never tried to "hit" the golf ball but rather to "collect" it as he swings the golf club. He said we want to complete our  forward swing, this was in harmony with Surges thought that we need to focus on our finish. Read another way of putting it that we are better off thinking of "sending" the the ball to the target again rather than "hitting" it. This helps us think in terms of the target and not the ball. Floyd also said he never thought mechanics on the golf course but always visualized the flight of the ball to the target.
So while much of what was said certainly was fine and would not hurt all we learn here I still listoned with a measure of care. After following Surge for nearly 3 years I think I can discern when it is in harmony with what I been working at and learning here.
One things for sure, as Don has said, the older pros often think in closer terms with his teaching.

Caddy Shack. That was Chevy Chase and Bill Murray at their best. Neeneeennaanaaaaa...... be the ball.
And it's in the hole! The crowd goes wild!!!!
On Dec 14, 2011 1:05 PM, "Disqus" <>

Astewart,

OK, I hereby refute what he is saying about PPGS. Now, let's move on to better things.

PMG

Good stuff Surge
 
I'm thankfull that I found you just in the nic of time before my swing became totaly corrupt with bad habits. Started playing golf reagularly over 4 years ago when my body could'nt handle squash any more.  I bought a book on how to play golf, to learn the game. Found alot of it hard to do, like [ club must be parallel to the ground & pointing at the target at the top of the back swing] when my natural swing has always been 3/4.  [front knee should point at the ball at top of back swing] always made me reverse tilt. I thought these were some of my swing faults and tried to fix them, without much luck. Could'nt get parallel at the top without bending my elbow or wrist or both , and so it went on. Then 2 years later I found PPG and imagine my delight when Surge said that 3/4 back swings are the way to go. Everything else he said seemed to make perfect sense to me and all so simple. Have gone from 100 plus to mid 80s now that I know right from wrong. I get a kick out of watching other players now as I can see the things they are doing right or wrong and love to see how they try to fix one mistake with another and another and so on. Just like to say on behalf of my back & score card , thanks mate & happy golfin
\

Hello Jim, good idea, I think I need to break the swing down and work on certain elements instead of thinking of the completed swing. I will do another video and hopefully the result will be I can forget about vertical for a while and just get a consistent game going. Regards Keith

I played Golf yesterday with my social club out at Woodville Golf Course in Sydney's West which is run by Parramatta City Council.    I won my match play against my mate who I had to give 12 shots to even though he out drives me by about 20 m on average.   I managed to beat him on the last shot of the day, a 7 ft putt for par after messing up a 30 ft for birdie  :-)   We finished before a big thunderstorm rolled through but I didn't get home in time to save the washing hanging on the line :-(

I again had a couple of those unnerving moments that I've mentioned before where I would absolutely nail an approach shot into the green but I would "think" that I was doing something wrong even though I would "feel" that I was making a good shot.   I would hit an absolutely bullet straight shot but think that I've "chicken winged" to compensate for a rotational swing flaw.  But when I recreate the shot I find that the sole of the club is perfectly vertical, the back of the hands are perfectly vertical, and I'm perfectly swinging up and over close to my ear - there is no flaw you dummy (I would say to myself).   What I was seeing, especially with the shorter irons, was the club face in the proper position but thinking it was open.

I was probably experiencing a flash back to junior golf camp where the teaching professionals, who were just getting on board with the new X factor theory, would criticise me for getting into "that awful flying elbow position" or "chicken winging" on the follow through.

Now all I need to do now is translate that awful chicken wing feeling of my shorter irons into my misbehaving driver :-()

Don't feel bad Rishelle.  Half the fun of golf is trying to find the " secret ". A couple of years ago I thought it would be a good idea to try combining the Surge stance with information from the " other place ". What a disaster that was!